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Jack Frost PPG WaveGenerator Banks

Sound designer Jack Frost has released a collection of over 200 presets for PPG WaveGenerator. They're available on eBay for $15, and can be used in both the iOS and desktop versions of the synth. There's an odd caveat in the license prohibiting them from being used on film and television productions.

Update: The price was $25, but bitching in the comments here got that changed to $15. We did it guys!

Video Description:

Get them Here: https://www.ebay.com/itm/253548879899...

Use these cool presets for PPG WaveGenerator so you can have an idea of the power of this magnificent instrument! All presets were originally produced on the iPad version. If you buy them, I will send you them by email. Ipad not included.

User- This bank contains 100 presets, most of which have been categorized in the three other banks. This bank also contains some unusual sound effects.

Analog Style- Contains 37 presets. This bank has a variety of pads, leads, basses, and sound effects inspired by the sounds of various vintage analog synths and hybrids.

Digital Style- Contains 27 presets. This banks has a variety of sounds inspired by digital synths of the 80s including but not limited to the DX7 and of course, the PPG Wave!

Modern Style- Contains 39 presets. Many of these were created without 70s or 80s-style synths in mind. Some might sound crystalline, and others sound rough. A few might even remind you of the modern appeal of the Waldorf synths.

NOTE: While they are compatible with the desktop version of WaveGenerator, an error will occur when loading in which the release envelope level is set to 0. You can simply adjust the parameters if you like. Also, you may use these sounds on public posts, but DO NOT use them in commercial products such as film, television, and other mainstream media. Please give credit to the author under the pseudonym Jack Frost.

April 10, 2018  | person_outline Tim Webb
Well now that’s interesting. Hopefully this guy is an outlier as far as rights go. Either that or hopefully not, he’s starting a new trend. In any case what would prevent someone from tweaking his patches, thus no conflict?
April 10, 2018  | person Dookone
Strange pricing, strange licensing caveat.
April 10, 2018  | person_outline Beathoven
Lol 😆 This is a joke right?
April 10, 2018  | person_outline cloudswimmer
What joke?
April 10, 2018  | person_outline Jack Frosto
I set the price to $25 as a reasonable compromise for both desktop and iOS users. Maybe I will make my licensing more flexible. I originally had the no tv or film rule because I want sound designers to be unique. Should I change anything?
April 10, 2018  | person_outline Jack Frosto
$25 is a compromise? Well, if this is what you do for a living then I guess you’ve got to make it worth your while. $25 for 200 presents is too expensive for me, but I hope there are others for whom it is not.
April 10, 2018  | person_outline Beathoven
eBay link says $15. A mistake?
April 10, 2018  | person_outline Beathoven
On April 10, 2018 - @Beathoven said:
eBay link says $15. A mistake?
I just changed it because most commenters were confused by the price. Does this seem like a more fair price to you?
April 10, 2018  | person Jack Frost
On April 10, 2018 - @Beathoven said:
$25 is a compromise? Well, if this is what you do for a living then I guess you’ve got to make it worth your while. $25 for 200 presents is too expensive for me, but I hope there are others for whom it is not.
How about $15?
April 10, 2018  | person Jack Frost
So I can't use them in my next Alien sequel?
On April 10, 2018 - @grammatonfeather said:
So I can't use them in my next Alien sequel?
The description notice is updated in the eBay page. You may now use them as long as you tweak/layer and give credit to my pseudonym Jack Frost.
April 10, 2018  | person Jack Frost
April 10, 2018  | person Jack Frost
So… What do y’all think about the patches themselves?
Well...I think that this is expensive:
1 - 15$
2 - obligation to tweak/layer the preset in my own compositions
3 - obligation to give credit to Jack

All together, this is too much (in my opinion).
- 3 is ok only if 1 is no more than 5$
- 2 is a no no for me. If a preset fit asis in my track I don’t want to be obliged to alter it
April 11, 2018  | person_outline Hg
On April 11, 2018 - @Hg said:
Well...I think that this is expensive:
1 - 15$
2 - obligation to tweak/layer the preset in my own compositions
3 - obligation to give credit to Jack

All together, this is too much (in my opinion).
- 3 is ok only if 1 is no more than 5$
- 2 is a no no for me. If a preset fit asis in my track I don’t want to be obliged to alter it
I will change the price immediately. I was suggesting that you tweak layer prests. What's wrong with giving me credit?
April 11, 2018  | person_outline Jack Frosto
Your stipulations about where it can be used, and that you must be credited, are just not common in preset sales. Those are the sorts of demands placed on free content, like Creative Commons licenses. This is the first time I've heard a sound designer asking either of these on a paid product.
On April 11, 2018 - @Tim Webb said:
Your stipulations about where it can be used, and that you must be credited, are just not common in preset sales. Those are the sorts of demands placed on free content, like Creative Commons licenses. This is the first time I've heard a sound designer asking either of these on a paid product.
I'm sorry about that. I'm new to selling stuff like this.
April 11, 2018  | person Jack Frost
@Jack Frost: The norm is that once someone buys your presets, they can use them in any media, for commercial or non-commercial purposes, but such a customer cannot sell those presets (individually or as a package). Credit is also not common, and certainly not normally a requirement.
You won’t be missing out on any fame - most of the people buying your product will scarcely ever make a dime from music. The people who do make money with music won’t buy presets or sample libraries with such restrictions because of the potential for lawsuits down the road. They have too much to lose.

By analogy, I worked in the prop & costume side of the Hollywood film business for a long time. We created a lot of high-end things that you have seen on major movies, but we never got credit on the films. Our job was to make the costume designers and prop masters look good, and it was they who wrote us checks for our work. The audience didn’t see our company name, but the audience also never wrote us checks. That’s just the way the business works. If we had pushed our clients to get us credit, that would undermine them, and they would be less inclined to come back to us in the future.

Although I didn’t work on the music side of the film business, I do know how rushed the timelines can be. A composer is usually one of the last people brought in to work on a project (unless it is a major blockbuster and the composer is famous). The composer is looking to get a project done ASAP under a very tight deadline and having many presets available is a time saver. Rare is the project that a composer has lots of time to create all new presets for a totally unique sound. There’s not enough time for most people to learn all the synths out there. A composer or musician will create presets from scratch on the synths he knows best, and rely upon preset libraries for the rest of the synths. The purists that only play presets they have created from scratch have that luxury because they make a lot of money from music (Deadmau5), or make no money because they spend too much time on fiddling with presets and not enough time on all the other aspects of a music career.

In your case, there is a strange overlap with presets that work both on desktop & iOS. Usually presets & sample libraries (as well as apps & VST) are more expensive for desktop and iOS apps are less expensive since iOS is still generally considered ‘non-pro’. This view is changing, but you are in a unique position when it comes to pricing. On iOS, $25 usually gets a high-end synth app with a lot of features and presets. So $25 for 200 presets might seem a bit much for iOS. However that price might be seen as reasonable in the desktop scene. I would suggest 2 separate prices: higher for desktop (advertised on PS/Mac sites that might attract the semi-pro to pro users), and less on iOS sites for the mostly ‘hobbyist/amateur’ sceen. Leave out the part about the presets working on either platform and see what the response is. Some will figure out that they can load the iOS presets to their desktop program, but you might find a happy medium on the pricing issue. Less desktop customers paying a higher price might roughly equal the income from a larger number of iOS customers paying less for the collection.

Just 2 cents that I hope helps. I’ll be curious how you decide to price this and if you drop the other requirements. The requirements alone prevent me from buying the collection.
April 13, 2018  | person Slam-Cut
Attention: I have moved the patches to Gumroad https://gumroad.com/l/TxdkO
April 18, 2018  | person Jack Frost
On April 13, 2018 - @Slam-Cut said:
@Jack Frost: The norm is that once someone buys your presets, they can use them in any media, for commercial or non-commercial purposes, but such a customer cannot sell those presets (individually or as a package). Credit is also not common, and certainly not normally a requirement.
You won’t be missing out on any fame - most of the people buying your product will scarcely ever make a dime from music. The people who do make money with music won’t buy presets or sample libraries with such restrictions because of the potential for lawsuits down the road. They have too much to lose.

By analogy, I worked in the prop & costume side of the Hollywood film business for a long time. We created a lot of high-end things that you have seen on major movies, but we never got credit on the films. Our job was to make the costume designers and prop masters look good, and it was they who wrote us checks for our work. The audience didn’t see our company name, but the audience also never wrote us checks. That’s just the way the business works. If we had pushed our clients to get us credit, that would undermine them, and they would be less inclined to come back to us in the future.

Although I didn’t work on the music side of the film business, I do know how rushed the timelines can be. A composer is usually one of the last people brought in to work on a project (unless it is a major blockbuster and the composer is famous). The composer is looking to get a project done ASAP under a very tight deadline and having many presets available is a time saver. Rare is the project that a composer has lots of time to create all new presets for a totally unique sound. There’s not enough time for most people to learn all the synths out there. A composer or musician will create presets from scratch on the synths he knows best, and rely upon preset libraries for the rest of the synths. The purists that only play presets they have created from scratch have that luxury because they make a lot of money from music (Deadmau5), or make no money because they spend too much time on fiddling with presets and not enough time on all the other aspects of a music career.

In your case, there is a strange overlap with presets that work both on desktop & iOS. Usually presets & sample libraries (as well as apps & VST) are more expensive for desktop and iOS apps are less expensive since iOS is still generally considered ‘non-pro’. This view is changing, but you are in a unique position when it comes to pricing. On iOS, $25 usually gets a high-end synth app with a lot of features and presets. So $25 for 200 presets might seem a bit much for iOS. However that price might be seen as reasonable in the desktop scene. I would suggest 2 separate prices: higher for desktop (advertised on PS/Mac sites that might attract the semi-pro to pro users), and less on iOS sites for the mostly ‘hobbyist/amateur’ sceen. Leave out the part about the presets working on either platform and see what the response is. Some will figure out that they can load the iOS presets to their desktop program, but you might find a happy medium on the pricing issue. Less desktop customers paying a higher price might roughly equal the income from a larger number of iOS customers paying less for the collection.

Just 2 cents that I hope helps. I’ll be curious how you decide to price this and if you drop the other requirements. The requirements alone prevent me from buying the collection.
Interesting. I thought this thread was dead. I just moved the patches to Gumroad, and you may use them freely now. I still recommend that you credit me if you want, but I guess no one cares about whether certain sounds are made by the composer or not
April 18, 2018  | person Jack Frost
I’m not familiar with Gumroad... Maybe I’ll look into it.
I’m not sure on this part, but while it is certainly acceptable to ask for credit on free banks of presets or samples, I think one has to be resigned to accept that it might not happen. The percentage of musicians that release music that they have composed commercially is pretty small. Most iOS musicians would fall into the hobbyist category. So professional things like liner notes on a CD booklet are highly unlikely. Those that release music as MP3s on download shops... not sure where such credit would actually physically go on a MP3. It is probably technically possible to put credits in the metadata somewhere, but who would ever see that? Most musicians won’t be organized enough to remember which presets they got from this or that company or which ones they were supposed to give credit somehow.

I have PPG Wavegenerator, but I don’t use it. Not my favorite range of sounds. However I encourage you to keep going as a sound designer. You might look at what Alba Ecstasy does:

http://www.albaecstasy.ro/ppg-wavemapper-wavegenerator-presets/

Check out the patches he has for other apps & hardware as well. Often he offers a free pack sorta like a ‘free sample’ then has other packs that he charges for. I think all of them are offered ‘royalty free’, which makes musicians more comfortable using his patches/presets. And there are many other places that sell presets too. Good luck with your efforts.
April 20, 2018  | person Slam-Cut
On April 20, 2018 - @Slam-Cut said:
I’m not familiar with Gumroad... Maybe I’ll look into it.
I’m not sure on this part, but while it is certainly acceptable to ask for credit on free banks of presets or samples, I think one has to be resigned to accept that it might not happen. The percentage of musicians that release music that they have composed commercially is pretty small. Most iOS musicians would fall into the hobbyist category. So professional things like liner notes on a CD booklet are highly unlikely. Those that release music as MP3s on download shops... not sure where such credit would actually physically go on a MP3. It is probably technically possible to put credits in the metadata somewhere, but who would ever see that? Most musicians won’t be organized enough to remember which presets they got from this or that company or which ones they were supposed to give credit somehow.

I have PPG Wavegenerator, but I don’t use it. Not my favorite range of sounds. However I encourage you to keep going as a sound designer. You might look at what Alba Ecstasy does:

http://www.albaecstasy.ro/ppg-wavemapper-wavegenerator-presets/

Check out the patches he has for other apps & hardware as well. Often he offers a free pack sorta like a ‘free sample’ then has other packs that he charges for. I think all of them are offered ‘royalty free’, which makes musicians more comfortable using his patches/presets. And there are many other places that sell presets too. Good luck with your efforts.
Thank you. I have bought all of the Alba Ectasy patches, and many of them sound clean and atmospheric. Not all of them push the limits of the synth, but some are really unique and useable.
April 21, 2018  | person Jack Frost
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